The Abidible Podcast
You love God. You want to abide in Him through His Word. But you just don't know where to start. You're in the right place! Be encouraged weekly as you learn to abide in the Bible yourself. Learn alongside your host, Kate, who is just a regular wife and mom (like you?) whose life has been transformed by learning to study the Bible on her own. If she can, you can! You're meant to be here, friend.
The Abidible Podcast
#067 "Marriage: For God’s Glory, Not Our Happiness"
Marriage isn’t ultimately about our happiness—it’s about God’s glory. In this episode, host Kate and her husband Jason unpack God’s purpose for marriage as a reflection of Christ and the church, a way to pass on faith to the next generation, and a witness to the watching world.
With nearly 20 years together, they share candidly about leadership and submission, communication struggles, and the lessons they’ve learned about quick repentance, assuming good intentions, and engaging conflict with grace. They also talk about why prioritizing your spouse creates lasting security for children, and how wives can encourage their husbands in the Word without nagging.
Even if you’re not married, this conversation will encourage you with biblical wisdom for all relationships. You’ll walk away with practical ways to love sacrificially, resolve conflict with humility, and anchor your life in God’s Word so that Christ is glorified in every part of your story.
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Hey guys, this is Kate from Abitablecom and you're listening to the Abitable Podcast. I'm just a regular wife and mom who's had my life transformed by learning to study the Bible on my own. If I can, you can. On this show, I help you know and love God more by abiding in Him through His Word yourself. Surprisingly, the key to a good marriage is not the pursuit of a good marriage, but to pursue the honor of God. That is a quote from Christopher Ashe, and you can probably guess what our topic is today for our second episode in this Ask Us Anything series.
Speaker 1:You have sent in a series of questions on marriage and we're going to get into those. I've got Jason back here, my husband with us again, to go through these questions, but we wanted to lay that framework for you that our belief, our biblical belief, is that the purpose of marriage is the pursuit of honoring God. Marriage is about companionship and unity, as well as partnership and mission. Marriage is about reflecting Christ and the church. It's about having godly offspring and generational faith, and really marriage is a witness to the world, and so we wanted to start out with that framework of understanding. This is what we believe the purpose of marriage to be before we get into those questions. Certainly, these things will come back up, but I get to kick it off with the first question. First of all, hello.
Speaker 2:Hello.
Speaker 1:Our first question from our listeners is how do you view? So like we're getting a little more serious right. Like last week we were like talking about how we met and like our favorite or like our ideas for inventions. This week we're talking like we're jumping into marriage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was serious last week too. I thought that was a serious podcast.
Speaker 1:That was not a serious. This is a serious podcast. I mean we are not going to be able to, in 30 minutes-ish, cover every single thing about biblical marriage, but we're going gonna get like a little more a little more into it. We're gonna get there we're gonna get there, okay. So here's the first question that you can answer, and then I'll see if I have anything to add. How do you view leadership and or partnership within your home, both spiritually and holistically, and has this always been the case or has it evolved?
Speaker 2:Wow, okay, this is a serious podcast, so we are going to go right into it. I think we view and I can say we, because this is a conversation that you and I have had and continue to have, and we are on the same page about it. So leadership and partnership, both spiritually and holistically, is that I am the head of the household and I mean I think the question is a good one in terms of partnership, because it truly is a partnership. So when I think about, you know, the idea of me being the head or the lead of the house, there's a few different things that come to mind. I think first would be Ephesians 5, where it talks about the relationship between husband and wife and a husband leading the wife. But it's as Christ loves the church, and so there's a weight and a heaviness to that and a responsibility that it's not a husband who just wields power and makes all the decisions and has subjects loyal or disloyal subjects in the house, but there is a responsibility to love as Christ loved the church. So when you view headship that way, it takes on a different meaning than I think a lot of people think. But then also you've got 1 Timothy 3, where it talks about managing your household and there's a responsibility there too. And then 1 Peter 3 talks about living with your wives in an understanding way. So going back to the way that Christ loved the church, again, there's a leadership and a headship, but it's in an understanding way.
Speaker 2:And I think that the way that we handle things is that, if I need to, I can break a tie, but we try to make decisions together and if we are on the same page, then that's fantastic. You know, I think we're going to get into that. And one of the questions, too, about you know kind of how we communicate and how we're in alignment on things and generally we're going to be on the same page. You know, as Christians, as people who love Jesus, we're going to try to follow what the Bible says on things. But there are also very practical modern day. You know, should we buy this thing? Should we go to this place? Should we take that trip? And usually we're on the same page about those things. But if it came down to it, then that would be something where I would do what I think is best for the family, obviously valuing your perspective, Liam's perspective, getting wise counsel. You know, not being done in a vacuum. So I take that responsibility and that weight very seriously.
Speaker 2:But I think to the second part has it always been the case or has it evolved? You know, I think I would definitely say it's evolved because as we've grown it has looked different. I think we've always had the same general perspective on this is what the Bible says, this is what we believe, but because of who we've been and being immature and growing, there have been times that I have not led or I haven't led well, which makes it hard for you to submit in your role, and you know it may not feel safe. So why would I submit to that? Or even if I am submitting, I'm a little bit nervous about what that means, what that could look like. So I think it's evolved, I think it's grown, but I think it's always been generally the same. It's just maybe played out differently.
Speaker 1:Yeah, don't you feel like we could talk for an hour about this? I mean, this is such a complex topic not complex in the sense of what God says about it. You mentioned Ephesians 5 and just a couple like here's word for word, you know, a couple excerpts from that passage Ephes the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church, and then you already mentioned this husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church. And it says this mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ in the church. And I think, just an aside, you know, I want to talk about us and our relationship and add on a little bit to what you said, but just as an aside, like from the world's perspective, this is offensive. You know, this is archaic.
Speaker 1:And this is also something that has certainly been abused. You know this is like I almost said something I probably shouldn't have, but you know this idea of the patriarchy in the sense of it being abused and I would say certainly it has been Certainly there have been men in the history of the church and of the faith who have taken this verse and used it as a hammer for women, and we would say that, biblically, what this does not mean is to submit to a man who is abusive, to submit to a man who is violent, who is asking his wife or commanding his wife and children and family to do ungodly things. So that's an important caveat. I think that we need to say, and I also want to say that the more you know and love God and understand his heart for us, his heart for marriage, his heart for husbands and for wives, the more you understand the beauty of this command, starting with the law, starting with the command, starting with the rule and trying to disconnect that from who God is and what his heart is. You know he desires families that are whole, children that are seeing an example of sacrifice, of respect, of security, of all of the things that can come from a home where this is walked out, but I understand that to the world and you know, I don't know who's listening to this podcast, probably primarily people who've heard this verse before, but I think it's an important caveat. Now I would add in for me the idea of I was aware of the idea when we got married, when I was 23 years old. I was aware of this idea of submitting to your husbands as to the Lord, but I had no idea how to do that, especially. You know, just like you're saying, you didn't know how to lead.
Speaker 1:I think that, again, abiding in Christ transforms your ability in any capacity to follow any of his laws, including the idea of for me submitting to you. Just because you were maybe at step one in leading when we first got married and didn't fully know how to walk that out, didn't excuse me from following the command of submitting and I, as somebody who is incredibly independent, incredibly controlling, this has been a really hard one for me and God has really had to refine me over time and, as he has, I know he's also been refining you. It's the beauty of what he's doing in a relationship with two people who are trying. You know, certainly not perfectly. Over the years We've been married almost 20 years this coming summer that he is at work in us to make this more possible.
Speaker 1:I would definitely say that I do feel safer submitting to you now, not because you do everything perfectly or because you have no sin, but because you are submitting to Christ. You are quicker to repent. You let me know when you're struggling with things. So the safety of that, you know, the safety that I feel in you is that you are submitting to Christ and I definitely feel, like you said, our marriage is a partnership and we're able to talk things through. But the point here that I would like to close on, I guess, is that you know my call to submit to you is the call that Christ has on me as a wife, regardless of what you are doing. Again, aside from and apart from any sort of abusive behavior, that would require different kind of discipline and other people getting involved your turn.
Speaker 2:All right. Question number two how do you work on communicating with one another within your marriage? Related how do you work through conflict together? And before we go into our answers to this, there's a quote that I think we wanted to read from Paul Washer, and it says how would you ever learn unconditional love if you were married to someone who met all the conditions? How would you ever learn mercy, patience, long-suffering, heartfelt compassion if you were married to someone who never failed you, who was never difficult with you, who never sinned against you, who was never slow to acknowledge their sin or ask for forgiveness? How would you ever learn grace To pour out your favor on someone who did not deserve it if you were married to someone who was always deserving of all good things? The main purpose of marriage is that through your marriage, you both become conformed to the image of Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we wanted to lead with this quote because we think that communication stems from how you see each other, as well as conflict, which is a part of communication, and how you see marriage. If I see you as my be-all, end-all, the one who has to bring me my happiness and I put all my eggs in the Jason basket as well as seeing marriage as the purpose of marriage is my happiness and my security and my, my, my then communication is always going to be difficult because anytime that you pop that bubble and you know mar that image, I'm going to be approaching you from that standpoint of bitterness and resentment and trying to even bring you to the side of you know you need to change, you need to do X, y and Z to fill those needs in me. And so I think, starting with this understanding that the purpose of marriage is to pursue the honor of God, for a husband to love his wife as Christ loves the church, for a wife to submit to her husband, I think that that really isn't a pivotal starting point how we see each other, that I see you as a brother in Christ who is in process. You are a sinner saved by grace, just as I am a sinner saved by grace and in all of our communication, remembering that and remembering that you need him just as much as I need him, and like the goal is, you know, unity in him. I think that transforms how we communicate.
Speaker 1:One of the main things I've learned, that I didn't do well when we were first married and I hope I've grown in is assuming the best in what you're doing, what you're saying, how you're saying it, just because you might not. I should tell the story of the time that I cried when I realized how difficult I was being. Just because you don't communicate in exactly the right way, with the right tone and say the exact right words to me doesn't mean that I should assign a certain or ascribe a certain motive to you and what you are attempting to do and to say and to be the best that you can In that particular moment. There was a moment early on in our marriage where we were having a fight and you were like trying to figure out what you could have said or what you could have done differently, and I was like trying to explain to you and I realized and then I started to cry how particular I was being and how much I was really forcing you to walk on eggshells, like you had to. You know, say it just with a certain tone and look at me with just the certain expression in your face and tilt your head 45 degrees to the right and, like, gently, put your hand on my hand. Like what did I expect? It was so over the top that I started to cry and I said I'm, I'm really difficult, aren't I?
Speaker 1:And I would say in our marriage I've certainly been the more difficult one. I think that you are a man of great patience. My mother calls you Saint Jason. My mother loves me, but she knows I can be difficult too, and she calls you Saint Jason because you're good for me. You know, you've taught me a lot and I said that last week about steadfastness and patience and all of those things. So I would say the main thing in communication is assuming or ascribing pure motives to the other person when they are communicating with you and asking questions like when you said this, when you did this, like what did you intend to communicate? As opposed to you did this, you said this. This is what you meant, this is what you intended to communicate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I feel like you. Maybe I wrote my notes a little bit too big, because it seems like you're hitting on all the things that I was thinking of.
Speaker 1:I'm not copying, I swear I can't see that far.
Speaker 2:I think that's a good one, though, in terms of assuming you know, I think you hear assume good intent a lot, which is not always the case. That's one thing like this Paul Washer quote it talks about like we're fallen and we're sinful. So we don't always do things with pure motives and good intent. But if we're always assuming negative intent or we're not assuming good intent or we're not giving the benefit of the doubt, then we're just going to be in constant conflict. So, like understanding, when you said that thing, you said these words, but I know that's not what you meant. But if I react to what? But you said this specific thing, instead of pausing and going wait a minute, I know who Kate is. She didn't just say that thing to be a jerk, she probably meant something different. Or when you said different, or when your facial expression was doing this thing, it's like well, do you know what you look like? Yeah, but that's not what I meant to do. Well, that's what you look like.
Speaker 2:So I think there's an element of that in terms of knowing who we are and how we want to interact with each other. So if something doesn't line up with that, like, well, wait a minute, she said that that's not who she really is, that's not what she wants to convey to me or she doesn't want to hurt me by saying that. Sometimes that may be true, but most of the time it's not. So I think just having that perspective in mind, like giving grace, giving benefit of the doubt, asking questions instead of assuming One of my favorite shows is Ted Lasso and he talks about being curious, not judgmental, which, from a Christian, biblical perspective, I think there's different elements of that, but just like the idea in general of being humble and asking questions and taking a pause before you jump into something, and giving grace, I think is always going to be beneficial.
Speaker 2:I think the last one that I was thinking was just engaging and not withdrawing, like specifically with conflict. I think there's times that stepping back, taking a second, is healthy, but I think you know we've learned over time facing that thing, talking about it, you know being head on instead of you know slamming a door and being separate, letting something fester, not dealing with it and then hoping it just goes away, but actually talking about it, unpacking it in a healthy way. So, yeah, I think everything you said hits what I was thinking also.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think when you're abiding in God through his word, which I'm always going to bring it back to, each of you has the spirit. You know you're walking in the spirit more than you're walking in the flesh, or at least that's the attempt that you're trying to put the flesh to death and to walk in the spirit, and so you will be more quick to repent. Like you're right, we are fallen, and so, while I want to always ascribe to you the best intent and the best motives, that may not always be the case, and so walking in the spirit means that you are more quick to repent because you are convicted more quickly. You're walking with him and you hear him. You know you hear his voice. So you're more quick to repent, or I'm more quick to repent.
Speaker 1:I am prone in our, you know, of the two of us, I'm the one to walk away, you're the one to pursue. So Jesus is changing that, that I can stay in the room and continue to talk, because oftentimes, for me, my frustration in the conflict which some people might relate to is just feeling misunderstood, or feeling frustrated that I'm not communicating myself well, or then getting halfway into it and realizing you know, I'm the capital, j jerk, and you know. Then there's pride. Like how quick can I confess and say, hey, like I you know what, like I really handled I started. I started that out the complete wrong way or I handled that in a really bad way. Will you forgive me? Can we start over? Can we go back? Repentance is such a gift that God gives us. That should be a frequent part of marriage communication. I think it's been a huge transforming element of our relationship because we didn't know how to do that at the beginning. We had too much pride.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Am I next?
Speaker 2:You're up.
Speaker 1:What are some practical and realistic ways that you can love your children well but also keep your marriage a priority?
Speaker 2:Yeah, this one is interesting. It's funny the things that I remember from college. Like you and I took a course together dating and marriage, courtship and marriage, dating and courtship. It was something about dating and marriage and relationships, but one of the things I remember from that was putting your spouse first before your kids, and it was probably just like a really you know a couple minutes of one of the classes one time, not even like a huge cornerstone, but it really stood out to me and so that's something I I try to do is that when I come home or when we get up in the morning like if both you and Liam are up like I'm going to come to you first. You know I'm going to come say hi to you, I'm going to come give you a kiss and a hug before I go to him. So I think just that is something I want to do intentionally, to make sure that he understands you know that you're 1A in our lives. And also I think that one of the bigger things is expressing that to the kids, like letting them know that you know your spouse is your highest priority.
Speaker 2:I think for a lot of people that maybe they've never heard that or thought of that or it's supposed to be equal or the kids are supposed. You know everything is about the kids, but if your marriage is not strong, then you're not going to be the best parents for the kids. They need a strong mom and dad to be a strong husband and wife, to show them what it looks like to have a strong marriage and then to be unified, to be able to parent in a unified way and to be unified in terms of relationship with Jesus, to be able to model that. So I think just showing it you know every day, and just that reminder, letting them know explicitly this is the case, and then carrying that out and I think I've even seen I don't know if it's movies or TV or real life or something, but kids reminding you know, like hey, dad, you didn't kiss mom yet you know, or like give mom a hug, like bringing them in on it, like this is how it is, and that I think can make the kids feel even more loved and secure when they can see their parents like that.
Speaker 2:So I don't know if that's the greatest answer to it. That always just kind of stuck with me in terms of like just making sure everyone knows. Oh, and I was going to say this question keeping your marriage a priority. I don't think it was intended that way in terms of, like it's just one of other priorities. Like I would say, keeping your marriage the priority. When it comes to marriage and kids, the marriage is the priority and making sure everyone knows that and you live that way and then other people can kind of help. You know the kids can help with that in terms of engaging.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I completely agree with you and you said most of what I was going to say. I remember that class. I remember that, standing out to me, my parents would say they didn't have this teaching and so I was sort of the center of their world. I was sort of an idol to them, and a lot of parents, I think, can resonate with that. It's very easy to love your kids. Kids are hard, but it's easy to love them and put them at the center of your life and at center of your marriage and put your identity in them, just as it is easy to put your identity in your marriage. But that's where we heard it. I remember it sticking with me and if you were to ask Liam, you know what is? What's my priority, in order of what I love?
Speaker 2:most he would say Jesus, daddy, me, and it's not something that makes him feel insecure, it's something that makes him feel secure, which is what you touched on. I'm gonna go on to the next one. How do you? Oh no, it's your turn, I'm gonna go on that. I would just say last thing on that. I think we probably I think everybody probably knows marriages that have centered around the kids and then when the kids are out of the picture, then the marriage has atrophied and there's nothing else to it. So I think that's another one where you have to actively work on this, because I think the default would be to just center around the kids. It's easier, it makes sense, that's what you see in other places, so it's just a really important thing.
Speaker 1:But we also didn't give any practical. Like you know, you and I get away. Sometimes my parents take me in, we get away.
Speaker 1:Sometimes, you know, my parents take me home, we get away. I would say we have had seasons that are better than others, where we're more consistently doing date nights. It's not something that right now we're consistently doing, I think, probably in terms of my recovery and how crummy I've been feeling for a long time, but that kind of stuff is also really healthy. To get a babysitter and to go look at each other face to face, with no kids needing your attention. Put your phones away, have conversation super important, practically.
Speaker 2:Yeah, probably a lot more we could say on that. All right, how do you become in alignment with one another and know it's from God? And some of the examples here were adoption, abidable where to live, et cetera.
Speaker 1:Well, definitely this is another thing that we've evolved in. When we first got married, we just kind of did things Like if it felt good. We did it. Now that we're older and so much wiser, now that we are abiding in the Word, there's a conviction there to involve God in the process of those decisions and I think also just simply by the sheer fact that we are every day, you know, in the Word and praying through decisions that we make together, it's like a much more natural path that we fall into, whereas that would have been a little more awkward in our early days. Like let's pray about it. Like what you know, we didn't pray about big decisions. I would even say like, honestly, I didn't pray a lot about marriage.
Speaker 1:I think I kind of did Like I don't think I knew what it meant to be in alignment with his will, because I wasn't constantly abiding in his will.
Speaker 1:It's like the idea of seeking first his kingdom and then all these other things will be added. Like when you are abiding in him, there is a check in the spirit. You know, this isn't, this isn't the right decision for us, or we need to wait on this, or we need to take more time to pray through it or we need to talk more through it, like there is a willingness to not rush into things, I think, when you're abiding, whereas before we would just you know it feels good. I think it's good, we'll do it. I mean, I'm not saying we didn't pray through our adoption process we definitely did but more recently, like things like Abidable, I mean we would go on prayer walks and even now, like if there's something that I'm struggling with or something I'm trying to decide to do, I will ask Jason to pray for me and we will talk through it. It's a combination of abiding in the word and then maturing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean I'm not going to say anything different, I think I would just echo it starts and the foundation has to be time in the word and prayer, because that's where we're going to know what the heart of God is and what he has told us explicitly in the word.
Speaker 2:So those are the first and the foundational pieces To build off of that. It's just, you know, you and I discussing things together, talking out, you know, what are we hearing, what are we thinking, what are we seeing in the Word, what's smart, whatever? We know, whether it's biblically, practically life experience, preferences, all those things talking that through, and sometimes that's enough. You know, like we do, that it's very clearly written in the Bible. This is what we should do. It's pretty obvious. This is the way we go. There's other things where do we start? Abidable or not? I have not found the Bible verse yet that says thou shalt start abidable.
Speaker 1:Well, we don't read the King James.
Speaker 2:I have not found the verse that says you shall start a bite of wool.
Speaker 1:No offense to the King James. I know some of you like your thous and thys.
Speaker 2:But there's things like that where it's like there's nothing that explicitly says that. And there are even smaller things, you know, like should we spend money to go see this movie tonight? You know, things like that. Sometimes there's not necessarily a right or wrong answer. You know there's a better answer. This is good for us and maybe not for other people. So I think, just like, if the Bible says something, there you go, there's your answer. If it says clearly, if it doesn't, we discuss. We have wise counsel, you know, depending on the severity of the decision and then sometimes it's just a matter of let's take a step and see.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know like both of these things could be good. We're not hearing anything that tells us one way or the other. There's no right or wrong here. Let's take a step and see what doors open, which doors close, which one is more fun. You know we feel better.
Speaker 1:Like, yeah, more in alignment with our passion, our calling, who we are.
Speaker 2:Do we go to Disneyland or Disney World, Do we go to Europe or on a cruise Like they're all good, you know? So I think it just depends. But yeah, I think we nailed that one.
Speaker 1:And I would add in, just to put a little asterisk and a highlight by Wise Counsel, when we've had to make big decisions, including abidable, we sat down with our pastor and his wife and said here's what's on our heart, here's what we want to do, like, test us, try us, ask us questions, challenge us. We want to be known in this. We don't want to be a vacuum or isolated, we want to be under authority in what we're doing. And it was great, like our pastor really did challenge us and ask some great, good, hard questions and also said like if you're gonna you know, presume to be a teacher, you will be judged more strictly and if you are gonna be teaching people the word of god, they will put you in a pastoral role and you are making a commitment to faithfully serve them. And also a challenge to point them back to the church. You know, to not become the church for them online, but to point them back to the value and the beauty of the local church and being a member and to serve and to all of that.
Speaker 1:Anyway, so it was like really good, like there have been many times in our life where we have a trusted, older, wiser or maybe not even in age, but like in terms of maturity in Christ and the body of Christ and the word of God, that we've gone to people for counsel. Okay, so this last question was the most common question that we received. It was worded a little differently each time, but this is the general idea you've. It was worded a little differently each time, but this is the general idea. How can I encourage my husband to get in the word without sounding like a nagging wife.
Speaker 2:It's a great question, and I don't know if I have an answer. The unsatisfying answer, I think, is it depends on the relationship, Like what's going to work for one relationship may not for another one. One answer may also be that you're not going to be able to do it without sounding like a nagging wife. Unfortunately, that doesn't sound great, but sometimes that may be what's necessary too, and I think of my for myself. There are plenty of times when I'm convicted, or I know I should be doing something, and then you come and you can do it, Like just the question we had earlier about conflict and communication. You could come and say it in the most loving, humble ask a question way, but because I know I'm supposed to be doing it and I'm feeling that conviction, I'm not going to hear it or I'm going to be upset that you asked. So there's nothing that you did wrong or could have done better. It's just a matter of my pride did not want that at that time. So I say that, in terms of, there may not be a great way to not sound like a quote-unquote nagging wife in the way that you do it.
Speaker 2:What I would say, though, is I think the first thing would be asking the Holy Spirit to be that person for your husband, Because the Holy Spirit is going to be able to do better than you can anyway. And so just continuing to be in prayer for your husband, asking the Holy Spirit, whether it's through you or through somebody else or whatever, I mean God can use anything. It could be a coworker, it could be a situation that happens in your family or something they hear about, it could be something in the news that, like whatever, all of a sudden just something clicks. So I think, if nothing else, even if you don't say anything to them, if you're praying and asking the Holy Spirit like that's going to be much more effective than anything that you can do. Praying and asking the Holy Spirit like that's going to be much more effective than anything that you can do.
Speaker 2:But other than I mean just practically, I think asking questions is generally a good tact. You know, instead of being like, you should read your Bible more why. You know, why aren't you doing this? And you should be like this person and I wish you were like. That's probably going to sound more nagging than hey have you thought about this?
Speaker 2:Or you know what does this look like? I think even sharing, you know, depending again on the relationship, I think if you share what you need as a wife and not can you read your Bible for me, but this is what I'm craving or needing or looking for, that may come off even better than what's going to sound like potentially. Again, why aren't you doing this and pointing the finger and and blaming? It's going to invite them in potentially more to see like, oh, I want to love my wife well, and if you're asking that that may resonate more than just you should be doing doing this thing, and I don't know I mean again that that could backfire also, because that could still like again, it's the condition of the heart that the pride is, could get in the way of that, to be like you're just saying that to get me to do this thing and or I'll try to love you a different way. You know something like that.
Speaker 2:But it's just it's. It's just a hard question because it just depends and a lot of it's going to come down to the heart of the husband and the softness and the tenderness and where they're going to allow truth to be spoken. So I think, asking the Holy Spirit if there are other men like if they're in the church but they're just not studying the Bible and they're just going on Sundays and are there other men that can come around, that the husband and speak in or ask questions or pursue. You know, sometimes that's going to come off a little bit better than the wife, but hopefully, and my prayer would be that, like we talked about in the first one, that the marriage is the place, that there is a unity and a partnership, that over time you see growth. And when my wife says something to me, it carries weight and it moves me and I want to grow and I want to hear that and love her in that way.
Speaker 2:And if she's saying it, it must be serious you know, and I I always think about people who are willing to come and confront you like that's such a big deal, like that needs to carry weight for you, because they didn't need to come do this, like they could have just been like, yeah, they're harming themselves or there's more for them, but if I go and approach them, it may not go well, I'm just going to keep walking.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to say that I have nothing to gain by going and doing that for them. So if they've gone out of their way to say like hey, I wanted to ask you this, I want to tell you this, I care about you, like that should cause you to pause and go. Okay, they're taking time out to do this, they have courage to come do this, they care about me enough. It must be serious, there must be some weight to it. So that would just be. My prayer is that pride would drop and there would be a humility before God has to come in and tear that out and break somebody, but sometimes that's what's needed too. So I don't know if that's helpful or satisfying in any way.
Speaker 1:It's helpful to hear it from a guy's perspective. I think I have. You know, we're already over our time here and I have so many thoughts that I want to share on this, because behind this question I hear pain and longing. You know, I know that there are many women who desperately want to be in a God-centered marriage and want a husband who loves the word of God maybe as much as they do, who's in it as much as they are, who's leading and doing all these things, and maybe that's just not the case and maybe there's not. You know, whether or not he's in church or in a church where there are godly men who are in the word, who could even come alongside him and show what that looks like, side him and show what that looks like. There are churches, maybe, where that's not the culture. You and I definitely have been in churches where that's not the culture, where men would even know how to come alongside you and counsel you, mentor you to be in the word, because they're not in the word and nobody ever mentored them Like. Thankfully, we are in a church where that's not the case now and a church that preaches the word and men know how to come alongside you in that way, but I think I would say it is a good desire to have your husband be in the word. It is a desire that God has put on your heart, and if it is a good desire that is from the Lord, then he can do it. So, one, be encouraged. Two, like Jason said, pray. The Holy Spirit can do anything. Pray more than you nag, pray more than you speak, pray before you speak and ask the Holy Spirit to reveal to you what the roadblocks are for your husband.
Speaker 1:The word of God is his very life. It is meant to be his daily bread. If he is not in the word, he is not getting life nor bread, and your husband is starving. And so, instead of coming at him as an attack out of frustration, there should be a heart of tenderness, compassion, concern and care that you. You know what you want for him to be, and the reason you want him to be in the word is because you want him to know and love God more. That's the whole purpose of reading the word of God.
Speaker 1:And if he's not in the word, he does not yet understand who God is and how worthy he is of that time, because once you start to understand that we've all seen, like those of us that are abiding in this way, it's the main thing that you want to do. It is your favorite part of the day to be in the word, and I understand for you women that are asking this question, that is the desire that you have for your husband. I would come at you in love and say are you in the word every day? And what's your motivation? Not to be holy, not to show off, not to put on a show for your husband, but to be in the word, steadfast, every day, no matter what your husband is doing. And if you are, then what's going to happen is the transformation, as God works in you and through you, for your husband to see something different in you. I would say that that's probably what happened with you and I, like you've been in the word and you've read, but like in terms of where you are now and what God put on my heart, calling me back and studying in this way, like I think you've probably seen more transformation. I had a lot of transformation that needed to happen, and so I think that your testimony and witness to your husband as the word of God transforms you to be more patient, more kind, more loving, to serve more, to show up more, to listen better. You know.
Speaker 1:Going back to even the communication piece, I was thinking like one of the ways that could potentially open the door for you to have this conversation more with your husband about being in the word is how you speak to him on other occasions.
Speaker 1:Are you cutting him down, are you interrupting him, are you disrespecting him, are you speaking poorly about him to other people in front of him or behind his back, like those are the sorts of things also that really can damage a conversation. Like, hey, can you? You know, I want to be in the Word with you, so you know who are you and what are you doing. And how are you abiding in the Word of God? Like I had to start with myself, like I'm not going to try to be. Like, though I want him to lead and though I want him to take the baton with that and abiding in the Word, I am only able to control my own decisions and my own behavior, and so I better at least be myself seeking God in that way, abiding in his word myself. And it's that idea of a woman with a gentle and quiet spirit can have such an I know that's for an unbelieving husband, but that can truly have such an impact on your husband as he watches you. So I think that's what I would say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you hit on a good reminder because I think my response may have been a little bit less uplifting and encouraging, but I think to remind everybody that God can do far more abundantly than anything we can ask or imagine. And even this morning in our band of brothers one of the guys was talking about restoring relationships in his family, and so we were looking at Joel where it talks about God can restore the years that the locusts have eaten and so carrying those two things that God can do more than we can imagine. And then, even if it's been a long time and you start to get discouraged like are we wasting time, you know, are we losing time? Will it ever happen? And God can do it? And then he can restore that time, and even more abundantly than it would have been before. So I think remembering those things and not getting discouraged and not giving up is I want to make sure that we include that in my response also.
Speaker 1:Wonderful. Thank you for answering all those questions. Okay, and that's it for this episode. If you know someone who would be blessed by what you just heard, please share the Abitable Podcast with them. Keep spreading the word so we can make much of the word. Drop us a review, tell us what you love and what you're learning. Check out the link to learn more about partnering with us by buying us a coffee one time, by joining our Women's Abitable Plus membership community for $10 a month or by becoming a monthly supporter. In next week's episode, we will be talking about abiding together, which is sort of where we just landed this episode. We're excited to be able to go more in depth with you on what it looks like for us, as a married couple and as a family, to do Bible study, prayer and discipleship together. You guys have sent in some great questions and we can't wait to answer them next week. As always, remember you are able to abide in the Bible. We'll see you next time. Until then, let's abide.
